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General Information

Civil War Sounds

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#1 of 45

     Posted Aug-15 6:26 AM   
David R. Mayhew
 
From  David R. Mayhew  Posts 15  Last Nov-8
To  All      [Msg # 128191.1 ]    

I am preparing a talk in which I want to mention sounds heard today that had Civil War origins.  The two broad categories are slang/idioms (of which I am especially short) and music.  Below is a list of what I have so far, along with working notes in parenthesis.  Any additions, suggestions, comments would be greatly appreciated. 

Thanks very much, DRM

Idioms/slang

bite the bullet
sold down the river (antebellum in origin, but reminiscent of the era)
grapevine telegraph
deadline

Music

Taps
Battle Hymn of the Republic
Maryland My Maryland
(official state song)
Yellow Rose of Texas (probably predates CW, but popular Confederate marching song)
Marching Through Georgia (maybe, but not often heard today)
When Johnny Comes Marching Home
Tramp Tramp Tramp the Boys are Marching
Tenting Tonight
Lorena
(not often heard today, but hugely popular in CW, and resulted in several generations of girls named Lorena, esp'y in South)
Whispering Hope (written shortly after war, perhaps became popular because it provided inspiration and hope out of devastation and despair in CW aftermath)

 

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#2 of 45

     Posted Aug-15 8:16 AM   
lukelemke
 
From  lukelemke  Posts 182  Last Nov-13
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.2 Message 128191.2 replying to 128191.1 128191.1 ]    (Unread)
Shotgun has several on his poems & music page. http://www.civilwarhome.com/poemssongs.htm
Also browsing his potpourri section might suggest an item or two.
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#3 of 45

     Posted Aug-15 3:36 PM   
jhnlncstr
 
From  jhnlncstr  Posts 1328  Last Nov-24
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.3 Message 128191.3 replying to 128191.1 128191.1 ]    (Unread)
David,

One of my favorite CW idioms is "See the elephant".

Another sound would be bagpipes.  The Irish Brigade had a  piper, but I can't remember their marching song.

Fife and drums were used by many units as marching music, and I am astonished you did not included Dixie in your list. <>



RYOS, John
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#4 of 45

     Posted Aug-23 4:01 PM   
meserves
 
From  meserves  Posts 3475  Last Nov-17
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.4 Message 128191.4 replying to 128191.1 128191.1 ]    

>bite the bullet<

I hate to tell you this, Dave, but this phrase is not of CW origin. I have researched it quite a bit and have not found a single instance of a soldier being given a bullet to bite on during surgery. Rather than break a man's teeth on lead balls, doctors gave them sticks or rags to bite on in those very rare instances when there was no ether or alcohol to dull the man's senses. A lot of relic hunters display what they call "pain balls," which are generally .69 caliber balls with visible tooth marks on them. Those marks were made by rooting pigs, whose molars closely resemble human teeth, rather than by men.

The expression "bite the bullet" first appeared in print in 1891 in Rudyard Kipling's Light that Failed

"Grapevine telegraph," like "sold down the river," is of ante bellum origins. It referred to a relay of messengers between Missouri and pro-slavery forces in Lecompton, Kansas, during the 1850s border warfare in the territory. 

>Maryland My Maryland (official state song)<

The words to the song date to the war, but the tune was first published in Germany in 1824. It did not become the state song of Maryland until 1939.

Now, if you want a common phrase that few people realize originated during the war, check out the origins of "hold the fort."

Steve Meserve

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#5 of 45

     Posted Aug-23 7:28 PM   
David R. Mayhew
 
From  David R. Mayhew  Posts 15  Last Nov-8
To  meserves      [Msg # 128191.5 Message 128191.5 replying to 128191.4 128191.4 ]    

"Grapevine telegraph," like "sold down the river," is of ante bellum origins

Lot of misinformation out there.  Somewhere on the internet, I found that the term originated from telegraph wire hastily strung in trees in various CW theaters of ops.  It appeared like grapevines in the trees.  The story didn't even ring true when I read it.

The focus (still fuzzy) of my talk before a women's club will be the legacy of the CW today, in ways we don't even think about.  (I'm not looking at major issues, just trivia.)  I didn't find that much idiom or speech that had CW origin, but will bring in the music (although some of those old CW era songs I remember from my childhood seem to have pretty much disappeared in the last 40 years or so).  From there, I will bring in the ubiquitous CW statues and monuments seen in small towns across America, in parks, cemeteries, town squares, in front of public buildings.  From there, I will mention a local statue erected around 1890 by a forerunner of the present day women's club, and the history and mystery behind it.

I'm glad I touched base here first.  Thanks to all.

DRM

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#6 of 45

     Posted Aug-23 11:02 PM   
meserves
 
From  meserves  Posts 3475  Last Nov-17
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.6 Message 128191.6 replying to 128191.5 128191.5 ]    

>From there, I will bring in the ubiquitous CW statues and monuments seen in small towns across America, in parks, cemeteries, town squares, in front of public buildings.<

If you need pictures of some of the monuments in this area, let me know. My personal favorite, of all the CW monuments I have seen across the country, is in memoty of the one and one-half million horses and mules that died during the war.

Steve Meserve

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#7 of 45

     Posted Aug-24 7:33 AM   
David R. Mayhew
 
From  David R. Mayhew  Posts 15  Last Nov-8
To  meserves      [Msg # 128191.7 Message 128191.7 replying to 128191.6 128191.6 ]    

pictures of some of the monuments

Note to self:  I'll have to learn how to use my cell phone digital camera and get some pics of the CW statue...

My talk will be given to a women's club in VT, and I will conclude with a brief synopsis of the vital contribution made by Vermont troops to the success of the Union armies, familiar to all but worth reiterating.

There was, of course, Gettysburg and the big barn door swing by the 9 month regiments (Second Vermont Brigade) onto the field, flanking Pickett's division and preventing a disastrous break of the Union line on Cemetery Ridge.  Then an abrupt about face by the Vermonters to rout the troops of Cadmus Wilcox, attacking their rear.

Onto Cedar Creek, and the Vermont regiments that stood firm and prevented Early from driving Sheridan's army out of the Shenandoah.

Not to forget Monocacy, where against overwhelming odds the Vermonters held fast, saved Lew Wallace's bacon and prevented the Confederates from storming into Washington.

Which brings us to the glorious First Vermont Brigade under General Lewis A. Grant that led the way in the last year of the war, from the Rapidan to Richmond.  With of course a nod to supporting troops of the AoP, capably led by the other General Grant.

I could go on to discuss the First Vermont Cavalry, and their overwhelming mastery of Mosby and his irregulars, but I only have half an hour to speak.

DRM

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#8 of 45

     Posted Aug-25 11:48 AM   
meserves
 
From  meserves  Posts 3475  Last Nov-17
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.8 Message 128191.8 replying to 128191.7 128191.7 ]    (Unread)

>I could go on to discuss the First Vermont Cavalry, and their overwhelming mastery of Mosby and his irregulars, but I only have half an hour to speak.<

It's probably a good thing you have only half an hour. If you can pile it thaht deep in 30 minutes, I shudder to think how many elderly audience members you might lose in 45. <g>

Steve Meserve

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#9 of 45

     Posted Oct-15 1:20 PM   
Wanda/Texas*
 
From  Wanda/Texas*  Posts 80  Last 6:52 AM
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.9 Message 128191.9 replying to 128191.1 128191.1 ]    

>> ...sounds heard today that had Civil War origins.<<

David

I'm sure this is too late for your talk to the women's club, but would the term, Underground Railroad, be applicable here?

Wanda

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#10 of 45

     Posted Oct-15 6:35 PM   
David R. Mayhew
 
From  David R. Mayhew  Posts 15  Last Nov-8
To  Wanda/Texas*      [Msg # 128191.10 Message 128191.10 replying to 128191.9 128191.9 ]    

I'm sure this is too late for your talk to the women's club, but would the term, Underground Railroad, be applicable here?

Hi Wanda

Yes, it would have been.  There were some underground railroad stations in VT, at least one of which is open to the public.  Didn't occur to me.

I originally thought I would be sitting down with half a dozen old ladies and informally discussing those aspects of the Civil War that would be of interest to old ladies.  They saw fit to announce it in the paper and put up posters around town.  Thirty or so people showed up, from all backgrounds and interests.  I had to wing it, but it was an INTERESTING EVENING.  One old lady showed up with her ggrandfather's Union belt buckle, and a picture of her as a little girl, taken in the early 1930's with her ggrandfather.  It fit in perfectly with my theme, "The Civil War - Not So Long Ago".

DRM

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#11 of 45

     Posted Oct-16 1:45 PM   
Wanda/Texas*
 
From  Wanda/Texas*  Posts 80  Last 6:52 AM
To  David R. Mayhew      [Msg # 128191.11 Message 128191.11 replying to 128191.10 128191.10 ]    

>> I had to wing it, but it was an INTERESTING EVENING.  One old lady showed up with her ggrandfather's Union belt buckle, and a picture of her as a little girl, taken in the early 1930's with her ggrandfather.  It fit in perfectly with my theme, "The Civil War - Not So Long Ago".<<  aside: I noticed you posted my reply in Yankee blue, so I posted your's in Johnny Reb gray. <g>

Hi David,

Sounds like a lot of fun, would like to have been a fly on the wall, but not present in person since those stories were associated with the Northern troops.   Guess I qualify as one of those lil'ol'ladies since as a 3 or 4 yr old remember my g'grandfather&g'gmother telling stories about the Yankees burning their family's crops in North Carolina when they were about my age. They would have starved if the family had not migrated to Oklahoma Territory via Covered Wagons.

My first trip to D.C. about fifteen years ago, made me feel very uncomfortable with so many statues which were reminders of The war around town.  However, my last trip there was rather generic with all the new additions.  I felt it was my town, too.  

Btw...are all the members here primarily from the Northern States?

Wanda

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#12 of 45

     Posted Oct-16 2:43 PM   
Anne Hughes
 
From  Anne Hughes  Posts 2824  Last Nov-22
To  Wanda/Texas*      [Msg # 128191.12 Message 128191.12 replying to 128191.11 128191.11 ]    

Hi Wanda, and welcome to the forum!

I couldn't resist your question, even though you've addressed it to David M.  The forum has participants from all over the States (and beyond!).  Steve is in Northern Virginia, John Lancaster is in Georgia, our beloved SysOp, David Woodbury is in California, as are Dave Mercado, John Barreiro and Larry Rogers.  Pete, Paula, Margaret Blough, Ray and Wayne  are all in Pa.  Terry is in Chicago, Rosemary is in Michigan and Teej is in North Carolina.  I believe Greg  is also in Virginia now, as are Rebecca Fitzgerald, and Frank Hardister and Keith (aka BlueGraySalt).  Tim is in NJ, IIRR.  John Eckard is in Pa, too, I believe.

Margaret Farr is in Canada, Urs is Switzerland, Lorne is in Scotland, and me?  I'm in England!

Apologies to anyone I've forgotten or can't remember where they live.  So, we're a fairly mixed bunch<g>.

Regards - Anne

 

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#13 of 45

     Posted Oct-16 3:27 PM   
Wanda/Texas*
 
From  Wanda/Texas*  Posts 80  Last 6:52 AM
To  Anne Hughes      [Msg # 128191.13 Message 128191.13 replying to 128191.12 128191.12 ]    

Hi Anne,

>>I couldn't resist your question, even though you've addressed it to David M.  The forum has participants from all over the States (and beyond!).<<

Thank for your welcome, and your response to my question regarding member's whereabouts.  Quite an impressive ensemble!  Nice to have a little background when posting.  I'm from the Dallas area, in the north central section of Texas, born and bred.

There is not much interest, that I'm aware of, in this area regarding the Civil War, most if any, interest in past conflicts is centered in the Alamo at San Antonio, TX.  We native Texans are grilled in primary schools on the historical elements of Texas exclusively.  The Civil War is touched on briefly in the later grades.

I suppose my interest lies in the fact my g'grandparents had such vivid recollections of their childhood experiencing the war that I became interested at an early age.  [I hid under their dining table when everyone thought I was asleep, and listened to  family stories about life's events.]

Thanks for your post

Wanda

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#14 of 45

     Posted Oct-16 4:27 PM   
lukelemke
 
From  lukelemke  Posts 182  Last Nov-13
To  Wanda/Texas*      [Msg # 128191.14 Message 128191.14 replying to 128191.13 128191.13 ]    

Hi Wanda, and welcome.  This is Luke from Colorado. 

Texas is well represented on the various tours and has a number of active "round table"  groups.  This link is to the Dallas one:  http://www.cwrtdallas.org/  Another great resource is David Woodbury's other web site which can be linked off the Forum Home page.  "of Battlefields and Bibliophiles".  http://obab.blogspot.com/  On the right side bar he has links that can lead you farther into wonderful and unlimited browsing into many CW related subject areas as well as the archives of his many interesting posts.

Enjoy,   Luke

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#15 of 45

     Posted Oct-16 11:41 PM   
Wanda/Texas*
 
From  Wanda/Texas*  Posts 80  Last 6:52 AM
To  lukelemke      [Msg # 128191.15 Message 128191.15 replying to 128191.14 128191.14 ]    

Hi Luke,

And thanks for the welcome.

 >>Texas is well represented on the various tours and has a number of active "round table"  groups. <<

Had no idea Texans were even interested in Civil War, could they be natives or Northern transplants?   I'll check on those links. And by being on several tours, do you mean there are battlegrounds in Texas?  I'm only aware of Texas battlefields related to Texas and Mexican war.

Thanks again, and how's the early snows in Colorado? 

Wanda

ps...I did check out the links and enjoyed reading them, including David's bio. Very interesting.   Checked the Dallas' CW link, and  would be at least a two hour drive one way to attend meetings.  Would not be so bad if the meetings were in the afternoon, but at night, too far. Oh well. Thanks anyway.


Edited Oct-17   by  Wanda/Texas*
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#16 of 45

     Posted Oct-17 12:12 AM   
lukelemke
 
From  lukelemke  Posts 182  Last Nov-13
To  Wanda/Texas*      [Msg # 128191.16 Message 128191.16 replying to 128191.15 128191.15 ]    

Texas.    As to battle sites Texas was not an active region.  A couple of "B" & "C" sites as ranked by the American Battlefield Protection Program.  http://www.nps.gov/history/hps/abpp/battles/bystate.htm  Sabine Pass and Galveston,  http://www.civilwaralbum.com/misc_list.htm#Texas  mostly naval incursions by the Federal forces.  And then the minor action at Palmetto Ranch which often show up on  trivia events as the last land action of the CW.

As to local interest, the Texans that I have met are usually natives, even if they now live here(at least part time) in the mountains.  Strong on preservation and participation, and definitely devote their energy to the Confederate themes.  You will find a lot of company there as you become more involved.

L

 

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#17 of 45

     Posted Oct-17 1:35 AM   
Wanda/Texas*
 
From  Wanda/Texas*  Posts 80  Last 6:52 AM
To  lukelemke      [Msg # 128191.17 Message 128191.17 replying to 128191.16 128191.16 ]    (Unread)

Luke,

Thanks for the links, I spent a few moments scanning through them, and bookmarked for later reference.  I didn't think Texas was very active in the CW since I never hear any reference to it.  As I was reading the Palmetto incident, couldn't help but feel a little sorry for the Union troops that were sleepless and their dinner was stopped by CS troops invasion.

Several years ago, I took a tour of the Eastern Region, and Gettysburg was one of the stops.  That was rather heart wrenching as the guide orally re enacted the battle as we approached each area of the battle. We even got out of the bus, and hid behind rocks as troops from both sides advanced.

I was impressed by the monuments erected around the field, the tour guide mentioned Texas had the smallest since Texas ALWAYS had the biggest of everything.  My comment was that a  simple and small native pink granite stone was very dignified, and in keeping with the reverence of the battle and the Texans who lost their life on that sacred ground.               He had no comment.

As for so many Texans living (part time) in Colorado, it seems that's all I saw the week I visited with friends in a small town south of Denver in '89.  In fact, one of my first cousins lives in Denver, and has another house in the mountains.

Wanda

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#18 of 45

     Posted Oct-17 10:30 AM   
tnblaurock
 
From  tnblaurock  Posts 51  Last Nov-24
To  Wanda/Texas*      [Msg # 128191.18 Message 128191.18 replying to 128191.17 128191.17 ]    

Hi, Wanda,

Anne included me in her introduction - Terry - and I live in Chicago now, but I've lived in California, North Carolina, England after leaving my birth state of Michigan. It was to satisfy my curiosity about local street names of Sherman and Sheridan that I began reading in depth about CW personages. Then, when a friend recommended the CompuServe Forums, the die was cast...and I've met this wonderful group and toured with them.

We have a member posting from Texas. Forgetting his name, but I think it may be "John," and I also recall posts about the Sons of Confederate Veterans (hope that's right). Maybe Steve or David will help us out with his full name.

Welcome to the forum!

Terry

 

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#19 of 45

     Posted Oct-17 12:12 PM   
jhnlncstr
 
From  jhnlncstr  Posts 1328  Last Nov-24
To  Wanda/Texas*      [Msg # 128191.19 Message 128191.19 replying to 128191.17 128191.17 ]    

Greetings Wanda,

Welcome to the Forum. I am the Quizmaster for the Trivia Section, and invite you to play. Particularly since the next question will be about an adopted son of Texas.

RYOS, John
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#20 of 45

     Posted Oct-17 9:03 PM   
Wanda/Texas*
 
From  Wanda/Texas*  Posts 80  Last 6:52 AM
To  tnblaurock      [Msg # 128191.20 Message 128191.20 replying to 128191.18 128191.18 ]    

Hi Terry,

Thanks for the welcome! Every one is so friendly, and I appreciate it very much. 

I've lived in this part of Texas all my life, but have been interested in Lincoln since I was very young...in fact, I didn't realize he was responsible for the CW. I thought he was one of 'us' here in Texas. 

It's fun to learn street names with historical significance, isn't it?   I've visited Thomas Jefferson's home, and one or two other homes of president's from the north.

Thank you for your wonderful welcome, and I look forward to becomming a member here.

Wanda

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